Ezra Klein I want to end by talking a bit about the brain itself and what all this implies for it. And I guess one thing to ask is why there is this difference between hurt and harm, why it is so possible for the nervous system to send such wrong signals, why we think the system didn’t evol ...
Rachel Zoffness I do not think in any way that chronic pain is a stress disease. And I want to be very clear. We know that stress is an amplifier, but it’s one of 642 amplifiers. It’s not the only one. Chronic pain is not a stress disease. And that is not what I’m saying, so if I ...
Ezra Klein Let’s talk a bit about some of those other pathways. So we talked about sensitization to pain. What does desensitization look like? 埃兹拉·克莱因 让我们谈谈其他一些途径。所以我们谈到了对疼痛的敏感性。脱敏（desensitization）是什么样子的？ Rachel Zoffness So ...
Rachel Zoffness You bring up a really good point, which is about more than prediction, which is that emotions always impact the pain we feel. And what neuroscience shows is that stress and anxiety amplifies pain and it turns up the brain’s pain dial. So the way I like to explai ...
Ezra Klein Well, this goes back to the point about chronic pain being a less reliable guide to harm than acute pain. And so tell me about this idea that the brain practices pain. 埃兹拉·克莱因 这又回到了慢性疼痛作为伤害指南不如急性疼痛可靠的观点。所以，请告诉我大脑练习疼痛（pra ...
Ezra Klein So tell me the story of the two nails. 埃兹拉·克莱因 那，告诉我“两个钉子的故事”。 Rachel Zoffness Great. So 2007 “Journal of Psychosomatic Medicine” reported on two gentlemen. They were both construction workers, because apparently that’s the most dangerou ...
Ezra Klein Rachel Zoffness, welcome to the show. Rachel Zoffness Ezra Klein, so cool to be sitting across from you. Ezra Klein What is pain? 埃兹拉·克莱因 雷切尔·佐夫内斯，欢迎来到这个节目。 雷切尔·佐夫内斯 ...
我们每个人都会经历疼痛，所以我想慢慢翻译这篇采访。 This Book Changed My Relationship to Pain The pain psychologist Rachel Zoffness explains how pain is a “biopsychosocial phenomenon” — and how we can better treat it as such. Tuesday, February 21st, 2023 Ezra Klein ...
下面两个真实的故事，也许会帮助你了解什么是“痛”。 …the story of the two nails. ……两个钉子的故事。 …2007 “Journal of Psychosomatic Medicine” reported on two gentlemen. They were both construction workers, because apparently that’s the most dangerous job anyone can ever have. ...
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